1st complete crew, 2bugs? and a lot of fun

edited January 26 in EmptyEpsilon

Hello,

Yesterday with some friends beginners, we were able to play EE 15012020 with 1 full crew (6 players). We loved it. I am attaching some photos and videos ;



VIDEO http://chipscrevettes.free.fr/ee/ee4.mp4

I had never realized that the consoles did not need a keyboard. lol

Everything went well but I noticed 2 problems:

  1. In scenario 02_beacon. At a station where we ask to be recharged with missiles, while we have enough rep and the stock is only half full, the station replies that we are already full. Even by defusing and mooring again it's the same. I had encountered this problem in the past.
  2. And when I hacked with success impulse engines, Front shield generator or Missile system of a ship in combat several times, I noticed on the scientific console with double scan that it was not damaged, it remained 100%. I don't understand. PS:I just did it again on "00_basic Protect the stations" I hack successfully on impulse engine but it remains 100% always


Otherwise, a ship called in for reinforcement could never leave its station on which it was bugging. I have seen this before but when it was bothered by other ships, not alone.

Thanks a lot for this game Daid

Comments

  • For the 2nd bug, the purchase of weapons :For example, if I have 35 reps and I have just 1 nuke of 4, the station tells me that I don't have enough because it would take 45rep for 3 nuke but I can't buy just 2 for 30 reps.

  • On the restocking of weapons. Where you docked at a neutral station? They only restock up to half your maximum. I guess the texts are a bit unclear on this.

    On the hacking, hacking doesn't damage a system. It renders it less effective. It's an alternative to damage, which is why science does not show it.

  • edited January 26

    "On the restocking of weapons. Where you docked at a neutral station? They only restock up to half your maximum. I guess the texts are a bit unclear on this."

    No : For example, if I have 35 reps and I have just 1 nuke of 4, the station tells me that I don't have enough rep because it would take 45rep for 3 nuke but I can't buy just 2 for 30 reps or 1 for 15rep. I can't buy in part.

    "On the hacking, hacking doesn't damage a system. It renders it less effective. It's an alternative to damage, which is why science does not show it."

    Ok,I understand. A pity that it does not appear in one way or another on the science console like the relay console. It helps a lot during combat and it will motivate the relay to be able to give real time information on the state of the hacked systems. It would allow the captain to ask the relay to hack a system in particular for a combat tactic implemented. and the scientist would have the information in real time to communicate at the same time as the rest (state of the hull, of the shields). The information obtained with the 2nd scan (state of the systems in%) would be more used: in general we target the hull and not the particular systems, suddenly these infos of% do not serve us much I think !? I haven't played much

    Sorry for my approximate english ^^

  • There are also 2 things I don't understand :

    • On the 1st photo, the SS2 spacecraft is supposed to be unable to move (rel speed look 0.1U / min) but in reality it goes around 4U / min. It happens on other ships (there is often a speed in negative) symbol - in front)


    • On the 2nd photo it is an example of a hack in fiendish level. however it is as easy as in simple level. I don't see a difference in level between normal, simple, fiendish and difficult.


  • @muerte hm.. that is weird, Wich version were you using? I just checked on the newest version on linux, and the lights game does scale (literally) according to the difficulty. It's 3x3 on easy and 9x9 on fiendish. The screenshot you were posting (7x7) should only appear on difficult AFAIK.

  • edited January 26

    Hi,The last version 15012020. On windows 7, windows 10

    I've just try again in simple level : Lights -->7x7 and Mines -->10x10.

  • Hacking Difficulty and Hacking Type doesn't work : if I select Lights, I also have Mine.

    Scan complexity works well.

  • Hacking difficulty/type contained a bug, it wasn't send to clients, so clients always had the defaults. (Just pushed the fix) I usually double check this on contributions, as these settings where contributed, but I guess I dropped the ball here.

    No : For example, if I have 35 reps and I have just 1 nuke of 4, the station tells me that I don't have enough rep because it would take 45rep for 3 nuke but I can't buy just 2 for 30 reps or 1 for 15rep. I can't buy in part.

    Ah, yes, that indeed seems to be the wrong behavior in there. Will take a bit of time to patch up.

    On the 1st photo, the SS2 spacecraft is supposed to be unable to move (rel speed look 0.1U / min) but in reality it goes around 4U / min. It happens on other ships (there is often a speed in negative) symbol - in front)

    The rel. speed is maybe better named "approach speed". It's the speed at which you get closer/further from your target. Aka "distance change per minute" As this target is circling around you, that speed is almost zero.

  • Hacking difficulty/type contained a bug, it wasn't send to clients, so clients always had the defaults.

    Ah, classic! That explains why I couldn't reproduce it, as I just tested it on server.

    The rel. speed is maybe better named "approach speed". It's the speed at which you get closer/further from your target. Aka "distance change per minute" As this target is circling around you, that speed is almost zero.

    I think app. speed could be at least as much confusing 😄

    So both might need explanation, and as relative speed/velocity is the common term, I'd probably prefer to leave it the way it is.

  • edited January 27

    The rel. speed is maybe better named "approach speed".

    In SNIS, I call this "closing rate". If it is positive, I also calculate an ETA (estimated time of arrival), which now that I think about it is not really the time of arrival, but how much time it will take to traverse the distance to the target at the closing rate. These additions were actually contributed by someone else, now that I think about it. It allows the science officer to say things like, "Target is at a distance of 10080 clicks, closing at 158, we should intercept in about 1 minute 10 seconds."

  • edited January 27

    Thanks Daid.

    • ah ok I understand better for speed.
    • How to make link between the ship speed in the database and rel speed. Exemple : Atlantis X23: 1,8U / min right on us = Move speed max 30 in database? Stalker Q7 42U/min right on us = Move speed max 70 in database?

    Are the ships still moving at maximum?

    • I see BlueShadow, it's true for speed.

    What about Hack succes on science console? Would it be possible one day to see the disruption of the hack on the scientist's console? or to mix them with the damage %?

    As I said above, I think it would be very useful as direct info on the science console because science transmits all the information in real time during a fight and the relay must focus on the hack and not have to speak. In addition it will motivate to be the relay because during the fights generally it is bored and when it arrives to hack, it does not have the impression that it serves because it is not necessarily exploited.

    What do you think?


    • Otherwise I don't know where to find the information about stations. I translated shiptemplate.lua

    Can I add it easily in science_db.lua?

    Thanks a lot

  • It is quite intentional that science doesn't get a calculated ETA. The idea is that you can calculate it in your head with the information you have, but it will take a bit of mental load.

    As an important task for the science officer is to decide which information is relevant and where to focus on. As science has an information overload, if you forward all information to your caption, you will overload the captain with information.

    I think the speeds in the database are per second. And, putting more power in systems will increase that maximum, so going faster then your maximum speed in the database isn't strange ;-)

    must focus on the hack and not have to speak

    Ah, no. That's the whole point of EE. Having to speak, and knowing when to speak and when not. If you could just focus on 1 task without interaction it would defeat the hidden goal of EE. So, science knows which systems are damaged, relay knows which systems are hacked (could be displayed a bit better). And combined they know the enemy ships effectiveness. Communicating this properly with the team is an important key aspect.

    Note that the whole point of hacking is to give relay something to do during combat. And if he does so silently, without interaction of what's best for the current encounter, or telling what he is doing. Then he is less effective. I think adding this information to science actually pushes relay more into the "side role" that is already, instead of pulling him out more, which was the goal of the hacking addition.

    I also want hacking to be strictly optional, teams with operations instead of science/relay aren't uncommon for me. And generally gave a better game. If I would do it from scratch, I would make that the default layout, "helms/weapons/engineering/operations" instead of the 5 console version.

  • edited January 27

    OK I understand. I like this 5th console Relay. Beginners doesn't like it but with scenario, it's good console which is very important to me at the start of the scenarios (make a quick sector inventory and ask for help quickly) and who must have a broad idea of ​​the general objectives by anticipating and not panicking and reminding the captain of the latest instructions

    For the next session, I will try to manage the relay better because there are many different combat interesting techniques with this information: per example the relay hack the beam weapons and impulse engine of the big enemy ship just before the close combat and then Weapon attack with the beam weapon, which prevents the large ship from firing with its missiles and causing damage in close combat.

    . I still have just a one question: How can I see the information of stations and that of human ships in the database? Example: In shiptemplate_starfighter.lua there is information about the MP52 Hornet ship but it does not appear in the database in contrary MU52 and MT52.

    It is interesting to know our ship information to compare our strengths, our resistances, our speed... before fighting, escape...

    I find it very interesting for gameplay to regularly search for information in the database.

    Thanks for all your answer

  • Player ships do not show up in the database to prevent confusion, as they are generally very different from AI ships, heavier weaponed, but lower in armor and shields. I opted not to put those in the database to prevent mistaking them for AI ships.

  • For context: we've run sessions for 9 crews that have never played before and 2 crews who have been able to have multiple tries at multiple missions (the playtest groups).

    They've mostly been running "basic" or "quick basic" with the "vanilla" ships on the 2019.05.21 build - thus a pre-difficulty setting minesweeper Relay station.

    We found for most of the groups Relay was most effective by concentrating on the reinforcement management aspect, spending reputation to send ships to defend the stations. The best "commander relay" players could almost win "basic" by themselves and definitely didnt care about the fight the player ship was currently engaged with. I'm not saying this is a bad thing - I think it's very interesting that the "commander relay" can basically play an RTS game while the others dogfight. Though for the next event we are going to tone down the reputation a little!

    It should be notice that we did have an excellent "hacker relay" player in one team though. His minesweeper skills were breathtaking and his crew had a startingly easy time dogfighting because if it.

  • edited January 29

    <<Player ships do not show up in the database to prevent confusion, as they are generally very different from AI ships, heavier weaponed, but lower in armor and shields. I opted not to put those in the database to prevent mistaking them for AI ships.>>

    I understand. If one day you plan to put them in the database in a specific section human ships to separate them from AI ships. I would find it useful. It is true that there are a lot of AI ships in the database.

    Otherwise I looked for the speed and I can't understand the link between the values ​​found in the database (shiptemplates_corvette.lua for example) and the speed displayed on the Helms console. I would like to use speed and rotation to use it in combat stratégies.

    For the human Atlantis: variation: setSpeed ​​(90, 10, 20) and speed of 4.8U / minutes

  • edited February 17

    Daid,

    <<a neutral station? They only restock up to half your maximum. I guess the texts are a bit unclear on this.>>

    It is indeed the same text for neutral stations and friendly stations. I modified the text but it would be more fun and more meaningful if it were different texts. It would avoid thinking of a defect in the middle of the game. Like in the scenario 03 com file -edgeofspace where it is detailed between the different weapons and neutral and friend stations.


    I finally found the link between the speed of the ships and the values ​​found in the base. Same for the speed of rotation. I will try to integrate it into my crew command.

  • The amount of refill for neutral stations (half) compared to the amount of refill for a friendly station (full) is actually customizable in the communications Lua script (comms_station.lua). If you create your own function to override the default (again comms_station.lua), you can set the values to whatever you want, even down to the station level.

    One of the things I've done in some of my scripts is make the weapon type availability vary from station to station as well as the reputation cost. I make the variance random so that I have less of an idea where things are when I play the scenario since I like playing these as well as writing them.

  • " is actually customizable in the communications Lua script (comms_station.lua)."

    Thanks for the information. I'll look at it more closely.



    "is make the weapon type availability vary from station to station"

    I realized this while looking for mines in one of your scenarios. It's a very good idea I think.

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