slow mouse problem on client consoles

Hello,
To play EE, I bought a few pc HP 6000 and 8000 pro small format (dual core E8400, 3Ghz; 6G ramDDR3 Win 7 pro SP1). A HP 8200 Elite 3.1Ghz i3 (2nd gen, 8GBDDR3) and even a 4th generation I5, 8GB Ram DDR3) and all these pc when I launch a client (Science, Engineer, relay ...) the mouse is far behind when we use it on the console. On windows there is no problem but on the game console there is a delay and it is very annoying. Even with a medium graphics card or on i5 there is this problem. It's only with my actual pc and my big graphics card that I do not have this problem. I do not understand, I thought in this game, for the client computers there was no need for much graphics power. Could you help me?
To give you an idea with the W7 performance index, the mouse slows down with the following configs: (Cpu / Ram / Graphics / Graphics 3D / HDD games)

1. (I3 3,1Ghz 2100 8GB: 7.1 / 7.4 / 5.1 / 5.8 / 5.9)

2. (Dual core 3Ghz E8400 6GB + CGU ATI Radeon 5450 1GoDDR3 : 6.5 / 6.5 / 4.1 / 5.9 / 5.9)

3. (Prodesk 600 i5 4th Generation, 8GB: 7.6 / 7.6 / 6.6 / 6.6 / 5.9)

but I have no slowdown server or client with :

4. Core 2 quad 9450 2.66Ghz, 6GB DDR2 + AMD Radeon R7 300 CG (7.2 / 7.2 / 7.7 / 7.7 / 5.9).

Thanks for helping

Comments

  • As the mouse is rendered just like everything else, are you getting a decent framerate?

    Also, these units might have an intel GPU as well. The system could quite well decide to use that instead of the higher end GPU. But that shouldn't be an issue, as I ray it fine on an intel HD 3000 GPU. However, make sure the GPU drivers are up to date. Else windows can fallback tosome default windows drivers which are slower then doing the 3d rendering by a small group of trained monkeys.

    Also, some machines have mouse/trackpad smoothing features enabled which does not play that well sometimes. So check that in the settings as well.


    We use less capable hardware in our setup, so specs wise you are fine. But we do run linux. Less driver issues that way, single image that runs on all machines. Out of out bin of free laptops, only 2 out of the 10 had some minor issues.
  • Oh and also make sure the drivers are not forcing vsync to be on, that messes with EEs own frame limiting in a bad way.
  • Thanks for your response
    As the mouse is rendered just like everything else, are you getting a decent framerate?
    1. HP 8200 Elite ; i3-2100 3,1Ghz ; 8GoDDR3 ; CGU integrated Intel HD Graphics 2000 (2GoRam-Core848Mhz) : 7.1 / 7.4 / 5.1 / 5.8 / 5.9)

    59fps

    2. HP Compaq 6000 Pro SFF PC ; Dual core 3Ghz ; 6GoDDR3 ; CGU integrated Intel Q45/Q43 Express Chipset(2,7GoRam) : 6.5 / 6.5 / 4.5 / 4.5 / 5.9)

    52fps
    However, make sure the GPU drivers are up to date. Else windows can fallback tosome default windows drivers which are slower then doing the 3d rendering by a small group of trained monkeys.
    I took last drivers on Intel et HP website

    1. i3 --> 26/05/2015 last up to date
    OpenGL = 3.1
    Directx = 10.1

    2. Dual-core --> 11/02/2011 last up to date
    OpenGL = 2.1
    Directx = 10.0
    Also, some machines have mouse/trackpad smoothing features enabled which does not play that well sometimes. So check that in the settings as well.
    There are not laptops, only Desktops
    Oh and also make sure the drivers are not forcing vsync to be on, that messes with EEs own frame limiting in a bad way.
    As a result of this mouse problem, I installed software application "Intel Graphics media accelerator driver and media control panel" https://www.intel.com/content/dam/support/us/en/images/graphics/sb/img/gmcp_3d_customsettings.jpg and inside, there is only 2 options for Vsync : "Activated" or "Application setting".
    Both of options do not change anything. And I don't know how disable vsync.

    https://www.intel.com/content/dam/support/us/en/images/graphics/sb/img/gmcp_3d_customsettings.jpg


  • 2. HP Compaq 6000 Pro SFF PC ; Dual core 3Ghz ; 6GoDDR3 ; CGU integrated Intel Q45/Q43 Express Chipset(2,7GoRam) : 6.5 / 6.5 / 4.5 / 4.5 / 5.9)
    And I try with CGU Sapphire AMD HD 5450 (6.5 / 6.5 / 4.1 / 5.9 / 5.9) instead of integrated CGU Q45/Q43 with last drivers (2015) and application Catalyst. I 've turned off Vsync and selected best performances but... there is the same slowness with mouse.
    I don't understand...
    As the mouse is rendered just like everything else, are you getting a decent framerate?
    Everything is ok except mouse latency.
  • does anyone else have slowness with the mouse? with a medium graphics card on w7? It shows even more on the scientific positions and relay. Thanks
  • I only have that issue with very old machines (running linux), there the framerates are also very low. So your combination seems quite unusual. If you have the possibility, I would suggest to try if it works on linux (live cd would also work), that may narrow down the issue.
  • edited December 1

    Hello, I'm coming back to you for this mouse problem.

    Maybe it's because they are HP pc. But it annoys me. Someone who uses old pc under windows can they tell me their return? Me on a 2nd Gen i3 with W7 SP1 Pro I have this problem.

    How can I easily try linux? I'm afraid it's too complicated for me.

  • edited December 1

    And I try again with Prodesk 600 i5 4th Generation, 8GB on W10Pro with last version EE and the mouse slows down too, specially on Science.

    Vsync is desactivated with 57fps

    When Vsync is activated, there is 27fps and the mouse is even slower


    It's amazing...

  • With vsync active, that is expected.


    How exactly do you experience this mouse lag? How "long" does it feel? a second, 0.1second? Due to how EE renders the mouse, there is a slight delay compared to the normal cursor. But this shouldn't be really noticeable, as it isn't a high-reaction game. But if you are used to playing FPS games, it might feel a tiny bit off. (like ~16ms)

  • On my powerful pc: Prodesk 600 i5 4th Generation, 8GB and integrated graphics: Intel HD Graphics 4600 there is a slight shift on Science particularly annoying because when all the enemy ships arrive, it is necessary to be able to click on it quickly and with precision.


    And on the other less powerful pc, planned to play on it: [HP 8200 Elite; i3-2100 3.1Ghz; 8GBDDR3; CGU integrated Intel HD Graphics 2000 (2GBRam-Core848Mhz)] and [HP 6000 Pro SFF; Dual core; 3Ghz E8400 6GB DDR3; CGU integrated Intel Q45 / Q43 Express Chipset (2.7GBRam)] there are several ms of latency, especially on the positions Science (the most marked) and relay.

  • Could you try this version: http://daid.eu/dump/EE_mouse_test.zip

    It uses the hardware mouse cursor of the OS instead of the rendered mouse.


  • I just tested. There are big display bugs but the mouse works perfectly on all pc.

  • I've seen that text rendering bug before on Android, the issue is, that the text rendering is done by SFML, so I have no influence on that. And I think the problem is that texture contents is invalidated on texture resize.

    However, I don't see how the change to hardware mouse cursor can cause that...

  • Why the rendered mouse it doesn't work? Maybe mouse drivers ?

    In the Windows 7 Device Manager of all my HP Pro PCs (Dual Core, i3 and i5), the drivers will look like this: HID Mouse. There are the last found drivers.

    I just retest tonight EE_mouse-test on my 3 different pc types: Dual core, i3 and i5 and ... it works very well! I do not understand!



                            
  • Why the rendered mouse it doesn't work? Maybe mouse drivers ?

    What happens normally in EE, "input" is processed, like mouse movements. Then the whole game logic is ran, updating ships, moving things, creating explosions all that. And then everything gets rendered.

    So there is some time between updating the mouse position and rendering. However, more importantly, it renders the mouse as it renders everything else.

    Now, with the mouse test version, the mouse isn't rendered by the game, but by windows itself. It updated outside of this input+process+render loop, and thus gets updated much faster.


    Which makes me thing a few options:

    • Maybe you are very sensitive to this slight delay (I never noticed it myself)
    • Maybe these machines introduce extra frame delay (for example secretly "triple buffering")
    • Maybe there is input lag before it reaches the input processing (I think this is highly unlikely)
  • <Maybe you are very sensitive to this slight delay> Like I said, there is a real difference between the mouse on the desktop (or with Mouse_test or my no Intel pc) where there is no delay, and the mouse in EE in my 6 small Intel HP pc (Dual core, i3, i5) where there is a real latence.

    So I think (maybe) it's because HD Intel Graphics. On the Intel website they say: "You can enable triple buffering in the graphics or video options of many games.No driver settings can enable this feature."

    Is it possible with EE to disable Triple Buffering?


    I am depressed, I bought these 6 pc only for EE...

  • I installed an ATI card (HD Radeon 5450 1MoDDR3) on 1 pc HP Pro to disable it (triple buffering), but it was not activated. Always this slowness.


    Then I removed the powerful graphics card from my non-Intel PC (Quadcore) and replaced it with the Ati Radeon 5450 card, and there is the slowness of the mouse this time.

    So, it seems that it is not a problem of pc HP Pro but rather a graphics card power problem ???

    So I do not understand. You tell me that with pc less powerful than mine you do not have this problem of slowness of the mouse. At home it's really gut the interest of playing (especially on Science)

    I am really lost.

  • I also do not understand it. I developed EE on an intel mobility 3000. Which is not powerful at all...

  • It may be OS?

    I'm on W7 Pro.

    Are you all on Linux?

    Nobody is on WinXP?

  • I've run EE on Linux (Lubuntu 16.04 typically, but also Ubuntu), Windows 7, Windows 10, Mac (under Wine and natively compiled) and Android. I have not had the mouse issue you describe. The hardware I've run it on is mostly older hardware (not very powerful). I recommend Lubuntu 16.04 for older hardware. From personal experience, it's stable and runs EE very well.

  • The machine I developed EE on ran win7. Also ran it on vista back then.

    I recommend giving linux a shot. It might solve your issues. As i think they are related to your specific gpu's opengl implementation.

  • What is the minimum version of OpenGl needed?

    I have 2.1 on my slowest pcs, dual core.

  • Well, I think to see a little clearer after several tests again and again:

    I have updated many drivers of the motherboard on different PCs with a little soft.


    The mouse works much better on pcs HP Dual core 8400 pc in which I added a graphics card Ati Radeon 5450 1G DDR3 (OpenGL 4.5) and a Radeon 500M DDr2 (openGL 4.5).

    However, for HP PCs with integrated Intel Q45/Q43 Express graphics card (OpenGL 2.1), not only is the mouse very slow on the 20190521 version but in addition the latest version of EE 20191101 and Mouse_test does not work with. The game has crashed systematically there where before there were display bugs.

    I think it's the power of graphics cards that is the cause or the version of openGL.

    For the pc HP i3 8Gram with integrated graphics card 2G Intel HD Graphics (openGL 3.1), it works properly and the mouse is ok with versions 20191101 and Mouse_test but only as a client. As a server, the mouse is very slow.

    For Linux, there are always the same radar problems. I can only use it for the engineer!? How do you do if you only play on Linux?


    ps: sorry for my english

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